Author Topic: Bioshock  (Read 8665 times)

Bioshock
« on: March 04, 2013, 02:19:07 AM »

Sixftunder

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Just getting this thread ready. I think I'm near the end because I just got to the massive plot twist. 

So I really want to discuss the story and setting more than anything, Dave can discuss how he hates the visuals and gameplay as always  :P

I will wait until Tar is finished until I start rambling. So Tar, would you kindly hurry up and finish the game :)
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Re: Bioshock
« Reply #1 on: March 04, 2013, 03:43:50 AM »

DangerousDave

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Just getting this thread ready. I think I'm near the end because I just got to the massive plot twist. 

So I really want to discuss the story and setting more than anything, Dave can discuss how he hates the visuals and gameplay as always  :P

I will wait until Tar is finished until I start rambling. So Tar, would you kindly hurry up and finish the game :)

Since it's not related to the nitty gritty of the game, yes I will bitch about the visuals. Specifically, that the Unreal engine is a blight upon gaming.

It's just an average engine, and it shows. The water, while a tad gelatinous, is nice, and that's good. But the problem becomes that the city itself feels more alive and interesting than anyone in the game, and that undercuts some of the emotional impact. Half the time you see the characters (always through glass!) they aren't even animated to lip sync to their audio. Are the splicers really deformed, or are they just the equivalent of everyone being even uglier than Halo 3 Lord Hood?

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Yeah, tech has improved, and yeah let's not forget Bungie historically hasn't done that well on faces (time will tell if Destiny picks up the slack where Reach started.) But the difference is key details were related in a much more presentable fashion. If you're telling things without cutscenes, the bar is raised, and that's where Bioshock falls apart. It's just a shame, as so much excellent design and worldbuilding gets coated with a paint of UE genericism. (Also, it's sort of hilarious how badly the radio portraits match up with the in-game models.)

Minor nitpicks on the actual worldbuilding, though. Why the hell did Rapture fall into a stasis field? We basically arrive in 1960, a few months after everything goes to crap; Atlas launched his attacks on New Years Eve, 1958. And yet when Diana McClintlock gets out of surgery a fair amount of time later, things are still mostly simmering. Open warfare doesn't really begin until a bit after that, after she becomes dissolutioned with Ryan, et al. So why the hell are the "New Years 1959" banners still draped around, and all these corpses just lying around for months in what should be still-used areas? The dancer's corpse has to have been sitting around for more than a year, according to the game's timeframe--no one checked on the smell back there?

There's a slightly awkward disconnect between the game's backstory and its present condition; you feel like you dropped in years after the conflict when it's still very much going on. I guess it's suffering from "Earth City Syndrome"--there should still be a lot of people here who aren't all crazed nutjobs. The beginning of the game sets things up so well that when you realize "oh, that's all they really have to show", it feels disappointing.

(I still think it's an interesting game, it's just a collection of issues that force me out of the mood it's creating.)

Re: Bioshock
« Reply #2 on: March 04, 2013, 03:49:07 PM »

Capac Amaru

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Just getting this thread ready. I think I'm near the end because I just got to the massive plot twist. 

So I really want to discuss the story and setting more than anything, Dave can discuss how he hates the visuals and gameplay as always  :P

I will wait until Tar is finished until I start rambling. So Tar, would you kindly hurry up and finish the game :)

I haven't finished it, but I already now about the spoilers.


dissolutioned

There's a slightly awkward disconnect between the game's backstory and its present condition; you feel like you dropped in years after the conflict when it's still very much going on. I guess it's suffering from "Earth City Syndrome"--there should still be a lot of people here who aren't all crazed nutjobs. The beginning of the game sets things up so well that when you realize "oh, that's all they really have to show", it feels disappointing.

(I still think it's an interesting game, it's just a collection of issues that force me out of the mood it's creating.)

did you mean disillusioned? lol

Also, 'dropped in years after' this so much. Its very similar to System Shock II in that regard, but in System Shock II it worked a whole lot better, because there were pretty good reasons for everything being empty.

Maybe one day we'll get a decent GTA style open world in a sci-fi setting...

Re: Bioshock
« Reply #3 on: March 04, 2013, 06:18:11 PM »

DangerousDave

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Just getting this thread ready. I think I'm near the end because I just got to the massive plot twist. 

So I really want to discuss the story and setting more than anything, Dave can discuss how he hates the visuals and gameplay as always  :P

I will wait until Tar is finished until I start rambling. So Tar, would you kindly hurry up and finish the game :)


I haven't finished it, but I already now about the spoilers.


dissolutioned

There's a slightly awkward disconnect between the game's backstory and its present condition; you feel like you dropped in years after the conflict when it's still very much going on. I guess it's suffering from "Earth City Syndrome"--there should still be a lot of people here who aren't all crazed nutjobs. The beginning of the game sets things up so well that when you realize "oh, that's all they really have to show", it feels disappointing.

(I still think it's an interesting game, it's just a collection of issues that force me out of the mood it's creating.)

did you mean disillusioned? lol

Also, 'dropped in years after' this so much. Its very similar to System Shock II in that regard, but in System Shock II it worked a whole lot better, because there were pretty good reasons for everything being empty.

Maybe one day we'll get a decent GTA style open world in a sci-fi setting...

Hey I deserve props for typing that from my phone with as few mistakes as that anyhow :P

Also I feel like they missed a major opportunity with the bug Splicers though: http://irrationalgames.com/insider/march-from-the-vault/

Sort of remind me of how The Last of Us is ripping off cordyceps fungus for their zombies.

Re: Bioshock
« Reply #4 on: March 04, 2013, 06:33:59 PM »

That Gunslinger

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Also I feel like they missed a major opportunity with the bug Splicers though: http://irrationalgames.com/insider/march-from-the-vault/

That is absolutely horrible... and should have been in the game. Oh, and for once I'm actually glad you lot are being so negative. I loved Bioshock, but it is one of the most over-hyped games ever made. I have so many great memories from the game though.
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Re: Bioshock
« Reply #5 on: March 05, 2013, 01:16:41 PM »

DangerousDave

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Also I feel like they missed a major opportunity with the bug Splicers though: http://irrationalgames.com/insider/march-from-the-vault/

That is absolutely horrible... and should have been in the game. Oh, and for once I'm actually glad you lot are being so negative. I loved Bioshock, but it is one of the most over-hyped games ever made. I have so many great memories from the game though.

I think ultimately why I still like it is despite its flaws:
1) it uses the art deco style, aka the last good art movement of the 20th century before all this modernism bullcrap took hold and ruined art and architecture;
2) it does a good job imaging the world and integrating some of the stupid aspects of game design into that world in a convincing manner;
3) It just feels like an honest game. While the themes certainly aren't subtle (What's that Ryan? You want to say your catchphrase again? Why not!?) they never feel like they're talking down to you or that they have any elitist streak for reading a kind of cruddy book (seriously, if you want to know why Ayn Rand doesn't deserve all the accolades she gets from vice-presedential candidates and bored wannabe intellectuals: she thought trains would be the dominant form of transport in the future. Talk about having a "vision", but lacking vision.)

Going to the slightly jingoistic, pre-WWI imperial timeframe seems like a very interesting place for a sequel, I'm just afraid my issues with gameplay and storytelling are going to crop up again. At least not everyone's supposed to be dead or crazy this time around, might make things interesting.

Re: Bioshock
« Reply #6 on: March 07, 2013, 02:59:42 PM »

Tar Alacrin

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I will wait until Tar is finished until I start rambling. So Tar, would you kindly hurry up and finish the game :)

Thanks very much for the thought, but I've got spring break next week, and me and the fam are going to DC. And I'm not gonna be able to finish the game before then, so feel free to unleash yourself.

On a side note, I'm gonna be heading into your turf Dave and Six :P
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Re: Bioshock
« Reply #7 on: March 07, 2013, 05:47:21 PM »

Sixftunder

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I will wait until Tar is finished until I start rambling. So Tar, would you kindly hurry up and finish the game :)

Thanks very much for the thought, but I've got spring break next week, and me and the fam are going to DC. And I'm not gonna be able to finish the game before then, so feel free to unleash yourself.

On a side note, I'm gonna be heading into your turf Dave and Six :P

Good thing I'm leaving for key west on Saturday for my spring break. You'll have to deal with bothering only Dave :P
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Re: Bioshock
« Reply #8 on: March 07, 2013, 06:06:54 PM »

Capac Amaru

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Damn it, between all this Bioshockan, spring breakan, Hotline Miamian, costco american cheesan, mexican coke...an....

I miss Florida...

Re: Bioshock
« Reply #9 on: March 08, 2013, 01:55:58 PM »

DangerousDave

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Damn it, between all this Bioshockan, spring breakan, Hotline Miamian, costco american cheesan, mexican coke...an....

I miss Florida...

ouch... Too bad you couldn't grow up and miss a nicer part of the States :)

Re: Bioshock
« Reply #10 on: March 08, 2013, 02:53:10 PM »

Capac Amaru

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hehe. to be honest if i ever do get around to going back to the US, I dunno if i'd go back to florida lol

Re: Bioshock
« Reply #11 on: March 09, 2013, 03:38:00 PM »

Tar Alacrin

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Wait, you actually miss American cheese? Thats messed up...


Good thing I'm leaving for key west on Saturday for my spring break. You'll have to deal with bothering only Dave :P

I'll just have to find your place and vandalize it or something :P
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Re: Bioshock
« Reply #12 on: March 09, 2013, 03:49:48 PM »

DangerousDave

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Wait, you actually miss American cheese? Thats messed up...


Good thing I'm leaving for key west on Saturday for my spring break. You'll have to deal with bothering only Dave :P

I'll just have to find your place and vandalize it or something :P

Working the deli counter made me appreciate white american cheese a whole lot more. It's delicious.

Re: Bioshock
« Reply #13 on: March 09, 2013, 04:10:54 PM »

Tar Alacrin

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I dont think its right to call it "cheese". lets try "American cheese-like plastic" or something a bit more honest
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Re: Bioshock
« Reply #14 on: March 09, 2013, 05:07:43 PM »

DangerousDave

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I dont think its right to call it "cheese". lets try "American cheese-like plastic" or something a bit more honest

Look at the ingredients, son.